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Craig Norris

Dec 16, 202429 min read

Exploring Apocalyptic Video Games

Episode 92 - With host Craig Norris and & Taylor Lidstone.

First Broadcast on Edge Radio, 29 November 2024.

Have you ever wondered how video games shaped our understanding of the Cold War? Today, we dive into the apocalyptic worlds of the past with William Knoblauch's 2015 chapter "Game Over? A Cold War Kid Reflects On Apocalyptic Video Games" from the book The State of Play: Creators and Critics on Video Game Culture.

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The satirical news outlet The Onion explores the impact of video games on youth.

Classic Atari 2600 commercial

Nuclear imaginary in the Missile Command commercial.

The infamous Ronald Reagan "Evil Empire" speech.

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TRANSCRIPT

This is an AI-generated transcript of the audio and it may contain errors. We may update or correct this transcript in the future. Please contact us if you have any questions about the information in this transcript. The audio is the official record of this episode.

Welcome to Episode 92 of Media membership broadcasting out of Hedge Radio studios in Nepal, Luna, Hobart TAS and as always on this show, we explore how media can shape our understanding. All of the world around us, we've got a.

Couple of really interesting topics on today's show, including a deep dive into apocalyptic video game narratives and imagery I thought, well, more appropriate thing to discuss than. Video games given the Australian government's recent effort to get through Parliament, the. Legislation around restricting. Social media for children under 16. So that's just passed today. It will come into effect in 12 months time, but it has meant that it appears social media platforms are going to need to take steps to ensure that people under 16 cannot sign up for accounts such as on Facebook, Snapchat, Reddit, Instagram. X There are some apps that are gonna be fine. It appears in 12 months time. Those include messenger kids. What's up, WhatsApp? Kids helpline, Google Classroom and YouTube. Wow. So yeah, some stuff will be fine, but yeah, this this legislation is just just come thru. Through I highly problematic in in my point of view and one of the ways in which we could possibly address this is through one of my favourite clips from the satirical news broadcaster The Onion, who many years ago now maybe 15 years ago, asked this question of not social media, but violent video games. And their question was, are violent video games preparing kids for the future? And I think we can ask the same thing of social media in a satirical way, but.

These have shown that these. Games are quite effective teaching office still to they'll need.

Let's see how they set U this question.

That moving on. Many of today's most popular video games take place in dangerous post apocalyptic landscapes. But are these games enough to prepare our kids for the actual post apocalyptic future? We will all soon. Face well.

I think they are. Studies have shown that these games are quite effective at teaching our kids skills that they'll need after the apocalypse, like finding shotgun ammo. And leading elite squads of super soldiers.

But these aren't the advanced skills that they're going to need.

So it's a good work that is advanced.

They're going to need the more practical skills, like how to build a shelter from abandoned cars or.

You're not thinking big enough.

How to find drinking water? They collecting the morning dew and human skulls.

Yes, or or or how to deal with depression when the sun is blocked out for 500 years by a cloud.

Of radioactive dust.

Absolutely. Now, that's the type of knowledge these kids are going to need when their world has been turned into a brutal hellscape.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

So that's a part of the onions. Wonderful. Take on media effects theory. I guess in this sense in terms of. Our violent video games preparing our kids for the horrible future that might await them. Yeah. Is the strain governments efforts here preparing kids for their future would be interesting. 12 months watching the debate. So what I want to look at is kind of look back in time to a short. Historical Review of Apocalypse. That's the idea of the apocalypse in video games and and pack. Some of the ways that can get treated it's it's, I think, a timely moment to be looking at violent video games on apocalyptic video games. There's a great um a series of texts, video games, movies that have looked at this most recently fallout. So what we'll do is. We'll start by unpacking it in terms of a couple of really interesting ways. One of the ways we're going to look at it is. By listening to a series of ideas proposed by the academic William. Cobble Witch, who wrote an article called Game over a Cold War kid, reflects on apocalyptic video games. And we're going to ask, you know, how how have video games shaped our understanding of things like the Cold War, in particular during the late 40s, fifties needs the 60s. Uh. And and how those apocalyptic worlds. And their portrayal from video games of the 70s and 80s, nineties up till today provides some really interesting insights and in many ways you could say these apocalyptic video games defined that early video game generation.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Let's consider those questions and, and feel free to message in where streaming on Twitch as well as. Broadcastingoveredgeradio.org dot a U and the FM system on 99.3 FM and the DAB you can SMS has on 0488811707 or chat to us in. Which U what are you all earliest memories. If you have any of playing apocalyptic video games, did did they shape your perspective of what the Cold War was like? And as the Union asks what video games best capture the way to survive a post apocalyptic future? Are they portrayed in in an effective way? So let's start first by diving a little bit into. In the audio book version of that chapter. And we'll discuss some of the key ideas that uh being raised. So this is. Uh, William Noble lunch and his piece on game over a Cold War kid reflects on apocalyptic video games.

A Cold War kid reflects an apocalyptic video games by William Knoblock. Read by Steve Marvel. In video games, the Apocalypse has been portrayed as both terrifying, oddly alluring, and strangely nostalgic. It all depends on which slice of video game history you focus on, but one thing has remained true throughout the decades, game designers keep returning to end of the world scenarios as a setting. In this essay, Bill Knobloch examines the shifting image of the video game Apocalypse from the Cold War up to today.

Nuclear war the very words conjure. Images of mushroom clouds. Gas masks and bewildered children ducking and covering under their school desks. But it's the aftermath of such a conflict that truly captures our imaginations, in large part because there's no real world equivalent. We can relate to introduction to Fallout 3. When I was 5, odds were good that you could find me plopped down in the living room, joystick in hand, playing my Atari 2600. The console had been around for years, but we didn't get one until 1983, the year of the video game industry crash. Too many games, bad games had ruined the market, so cartridges were cheap. Soon I owned most of the classics. Donkey Kong, Pacman, Cubert, even the infamously bad ET the extra. The retrial.

But so put it there and it might be worth setting the kind of atmosphere for this generation that is mapping out here the the early initial video game engagement in the late 70s with a with a great Atari 2600 commercial.

You're a Starship captain, and that's the.

By the way. You shield. That's **** *** Commander defending your city if you're not quick enough, they'll show. No, stop us from the sky. They drop.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Three out of this world games from Atari, the number one video computer system with more games than any other.

Hammering was gone and the number one video game.

So that's the Atari promotional campaign from for the Atari 2600 for Asteroids Missile Command and Space Invaders. And of course, that's this kind of early 1st generation of of apocalyptic type imagery. In in games which you know can get unpacked in in this way, let's return now to how we could consider that.

Favourite Atari Game was missile command. Its premise was pretty simple, as missiles dropped from the top of the screen, you shoot them down to defend cities below. Destroy all the missiles and you advance to the next level. The higher the level, the faster they attack. When all the cities were destroyed, which is inevitable, its game over missile command was pretty intuitive. But as a kid, I wondered why the cities were under attack.

So again, one of the great things about missile command is is does it hold up? So first we'll have a quick listen to you know, an interesting contemporary take on it, which is Conan the X late night. Most who on his team Coco Video channel did a kind of reactive video to playing missile command recently. So let's see how he sums up this game from the 1970s as he plugs it in and attempts to play it.

Pride. Alright, now we're gonna look at missile command. Another Atari game that promises much more than it can deliver with the.

Cover art, it's.

Aliens from the Planet of Crystal have begun an attack on the planet Zardan. The Kryptonians had begun so sad.

It's if someone had.

The right this and you know what? We know we're about to see 3 blips. They prepared me for ohh. There we go. Yeah, those are Sardinians and Criterion's alright. What do I do?

So you. The dash around. Yeah. So the coloured circles knockout the blips.

OK. And while you're explaining to me, I've lost my city.

But you know what this city looks like ****. So I didn't care at the time. What's really scary is this one.

But the sophistication of the computer that controlled all our nuclear missiles, the Russians probably saw these games and thought we should attack. Now what? These are.

So again, a wonderful encapsulation of that kind of really basic graphic bit level engagements with apocalyptic imagery and dovetailing into. The Cold War. Of course, as Cohen pointed out, one of the great kind of bait and switches for video games was how deceptively. And their advertising, particularly the cover art, looked fantastic. Missile command. Brilliant cover art. You know, controllers in behind a panel desk as missiles are being launched and you're attempting to prevent them from hitting and destroying your cities, which is basically what the gameplay is. Do you know you've got these vertical lines sitting down or dining diagonal lines hitting down from the top of the screen? Which kind of missile trail? And you've got a a kind of cursor that you can move around the screen in your attempts to prevent and block the missile from striking you your city. If we have a look at a great missile command commercial, which again captures the world that they're trying to portray here, this is from 1980.

I'm going out to inspect the troops, Mr Ohh.

Regular change today general.

This is a Tari missile command. Millions of people are mad. Thousands of game centres across the country. You penny. War is attention all generals. Now you can get your own Atari misses them on video game and practise saving the world in a privacy of your home missile command only from Atari.

Practise saving the world in the privacy. Of your own lounge. So again, that's it's missile command. And in terms of its significance, we in here that reflected in the the chapter we're hearing now.

The game's manual explains that aliens from the planet of Krytal have begun an attack on the planet Zardon. The Kryptonians are warriors out to destroy and seize the planet of Zardon. The last of the peaceful place. Krytal Zardon Atari's bee movie plot line did more than provide an explanation of gameplay. It changed. Missile commands original theme game designer Dave Thurer originally envisioned missile command to be a realistic missile defence game set in the present. A Cold War game that would get people to become aware of the horrors of a nuclear war. Considering the technological limitations he faced, Thurs. Arcade Classic presented a surprisingly detailed nuclear vision. Missile command features an ANTIBALLISTIC missile system, intercontinental ballistic missiles, multiple independent RE entry vehicles and smart bombs, all real Cold War nuclear. Weapons. When? All your cities are finally destroyed. Instead of the ubiquitous game over screen, missile command concluded with a far more ominous warning about the possibility of an atomic apocalypse. The end note Atari graphics were so basic that sometimes storylines were needed to make sense of a game. For example, adventures manual explains that an evil magician has stolen the enchanted chalice and has hidden it somewhere in the Kingdom. The object of the game is to rescue. The Enchanted Chalice and place it inside the Golden Castle where it belongs. This was welcome information because in the game you control a movable dot that drags blurry items around the screen. In the Atari age, a little story went a long way. Screenshot one. Are.

Get what we can see. There is the significance of the imagery that's being created in the video game text that.

Sorry can likely be traced to the very Cold War tensions that inspired missile command in the 1st place, when thorough designed the game in 1980, the Soviets had just invaded Afghanistan. Ronald Reagan promised to escalate the arms race, and conservative pundits were bragging that they could win. And nuclear. 4IN response, a nuclear freeze campaign swept the nation, begging both sides to stop making nukes, and by 1982 it was the largest anti nuclear protest movement in American history. In March, Reagan called the Soviet Union and Evil empire and its September 1983. The Soviets shot down a civilian air. Miner a month later, right around the time I was shooting digital missiles in missile command. Real US nuclear warheads were on their way to Western Europe, while Soviet medium range S 20s already lined the Eastern bloc. By November, a maid for.

It will just pause it quickly.

There's of course that's. Then yeah, that's that's that's quite interesting. Little deep dive into. Ohh the. If the, I guess it's part of the history of these epic games. What? I'm gonna play who's referencing there. Uh. The Ronald Reagan speech. The evil empire. Ronald Reagan speech have you ever heard that?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

We're gonna listen to it now. Cool. This is the the. Infamous speech that Ronald Reagan gave. And again, what this is kind of setting up is that to understand early video games from the 70s, you need to understand the Cold War and part of the Cold War was, you know, Reagan kind of also bringing it back with this speech that he gave. Which is that kind of, you know and?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

So here with Reagan.

It's worth stating it because yeah, there might be some other doesn't know.

Of course he was president of the United States during the 80s. Multiple terms. Um, we're gonna go too much into the. Politics of what Reagan represented except. For this evil empire speech, which, yeah. Yeah. So this mean at 10.

Let us be aware that while they preach the supremacy of the state. Declare its omnipotence over individual man and predict its eventual domination of all peoples on the earth. They are the focus of evil in the modern world, but if history teaches anything, it teaches that simple minded appeasement or wishful thinking about our adversaries as folly. It means the betrayal of our past, the squandering of our freedom. So I urge you to speak out against those who would place the United States in a position of military and moral inferiority. You know, I've always believed that old screw tape reserved his best efforts. For those of you in the church, so in.

Your I think the old time is hitting in.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Who is a good speaker but Trump? Trump is better.

Yeah. Well, guess you guess what's interesting with that clip is the. You know the stakes are high. We've got this evil Iranian empire, the emergence of a kind of new battleground to to employ it. Yeah, I guess very similar. Maybe not the Trump analogy, but maybe you straining government social media ban analogy, right?

Is this this kind of pervasive evil that we need to go to war against? And you know the reason why I'm setting up so, OK, the Lord Taylor's just joined us.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Ohh yeah by the way, yeah.

And to bring it to me, the reason I'm setting up this discussion of apocalyptic video games is that it reminded me of lot of the onion sketch, where they asked the question how are violent video games preparing today's youth for the future?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah. Well, yeah. For the apocalypse and and you know, it's a nice satirical take on questions of, you know, what youth should be, what youth should be doing, what it means to be young.

And it's it's interesting when you surrounded by material like you were in the Cold War of an apocalypse. Today's narrative. There isn't really. I mean, you've got series like the Fallout TV show based on the video game, which I kind of engaging with this apocalyptic imagery. Ohh.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Are we going into sort of like fantasy apocalyptic like zombies and?

Well, well, yeah, we'll get around. To that, because I mean this. So this article that we're listening to is written by history professor, and he's setting up the argument that it's kind of a bemoaning a bit. You know, he's talking about his own childhood, and he had the Atari, and he played games like missile command. Uh.

And during that period of the 70s, they were engaged with ideas of the Cold War, right? So missile command the guy, the developer that pitched said, you know, he wanted it to be something that wouldn't get people asking questions about, you know, how not necessarily nuclear will works, but how. Pocklington Nuclear War would be it would be destructive and damaging.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, yeah. So like how space Invaders is preparing us for war with an alien race.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

And then of course, the pixels movie happened and we saw that happening.

Ohh here's yeah look. And he brings up these more modern cases like the Fallout Universe where you've got zombies inhabiting it. And he says, you know that. Those those aren't engaged with necessarily ideological struggles which these games were in the 70s, you know, missile command and the narratives of of the Apocalypse, was was rooted in some ideological questions of that time. You had the evil. Well, this is what the evil. Empire speech is all about. Ideology that you have these two ideologically opposed. 1st. Forces right in the Cold War. It was communist Russia and the Communist bloc against the, you know, the the democratic countries and. And it was an ideologically framed apocalypse, right? It was going to be launched, there was a 0 sum game, right? You either win or lose. Well, actually, yeah. No, it was mutually saw destruction Mod 07 game.

It was just mutually showed the struction. Uh, so say yeah, the the only logical underpinnings don't really pay off anymore, but we'll we'll pick it up here. So 5 minutes and 33 into the chapter that goes for 44 minutes. My. So what I'm going to get through it all, but we'll set up his opening argument and offer a reflection as gamers ourselves on if we share some of these sentiments. So let's hear. What it is? What is framing now?

The movie The day after reflected the nation's heightened levels of atomic anxiety. An estimated 100 million viewers tuned in for a foe atomic attack on Middle America, prompting heated debates around the country.

Have you seen that beauty the day after?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Day after. No, I've seen the day after tomorrow.

But it's interest. Yeah. No. The day after. Came out 80s and I wonder if the day after tomorrow is kind of based on that. It was considered to be, uhm, one of the the really kind of shocking TV pieces created. I will listen to the trailer. This is the trailer for the day after.

In anything morning 6/1.

You know, and how much consortiums.

Report on the build up man.

Through that, settings of both military units being mobilised.

President is presently in direct communication pleasure.

Please. Current.

We're on the toilet situation and we might take particular note to the nuclear submarines off the east and.

West Coast already captured later back positions.

And there's all this kind of raise it rising military anxiety, military being mobilised in there.

Are you guys hear anything about an alert?

I really don't think he decided he wants to be the first. He is a nuclear deal.

Not East Germany.

The question of who and where.

Sealed off the borders to West Berlin, closing short principal Westerman, access further attacking bird.

Crazy, but not that crazy.

I don't believe it's happening.

We have a massive.

Attack in the US at this time IBM's.

Yeah, #300 vessels in bound house.

I like all the. Either we fired 1st and they're try to hit what's left. But they park first. We just got our missiles. Out of the ground in time.

So it's a very you. Know it's it's.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

The sounds of war and.

Destruction, but yes, and it's an attempt. To do it very realistically.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

In terms of. Not a a complete. And again, sorry, we're going to restream again now. Maybe. And I like that ratio, yeah. Yeah. So. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the day after tomorrow. The the movie show. The day after tomorrow.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

It was the day after.

Yep. Sorry. You're right, you're right. Ohh, let's just keep rolling the dice. Uh, yeah. So let's let's now pick it up again with how this was being discussed.

Considering this national level of nuclear fear, America's highest since the 1962 Cuban Missile Crisis, Atari space Alien plot line makes sense. It presented a kid friendly narrative during a dangerous time note. Originally, missile command was entitled Armageddon and featured real cities along the California coast. In its original arcade incarnation, Missile command provided one of the first apocalyptic visions in video game history. Yet even now, years after the Cold War's conclusion, the end of the world remains a popular trope for the medium. Gamers continue to explore post apocalyptic landscapes, fight off extraterrestrial invasions, and battle roaming zombie. Or I'm not immune to this fascination. I still enjoy games about Armageddon, but over three decades, something changed. Unlike 1980s games with serious undertones, today's games largely present the Apocalypse lazily as a throw away narrative backdrop for first person shooters. I want to trace this evolution to look back at some of the most interesting apocalyptic video games ever made.

So will return in a second. To hear more of some of the most apocalyptic video games ever made here on Edge Radio, 99.3 FM with Medium. Other ship visited by Doctor Craig and Lyle Taylor.

I no, it's all right. Again. When the follow you round.

Change nothing. And. Aside. I letting it all. Round. Yeah. Ohh. Haha. And. Ohh. First Farr. Sleep. It's beautiful. Only love, and I think girls with love was the life. Where is it fun? Ohh night so I can hold you in now. Ohh.

And you're listening to media membership here on Edge Radio? 9.3 FM. That was some really groovy. Ohh, I've introduced some buzzing to this tree. Yeah. Dan. Anyway, really groovy tunes by clean Dees.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, really good song. Enjoyed that?

No, the artist is king Billy. So that's by King Billy and the song's King's. Anyway, we're listening now to deep dive into apocalyptic video game material, and we we left on a real cliffhanger in terms of what is the historical theorist William the Noble launch. I believe that's how it's pronounced from announced. I've struggled that and the whole episode today SMS in now if you have a better version of that surname and yeah, he was about to unveil call video game text that defined this apocalypse.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

That can't be right.

So we're rejoined now with William Noble. U with his theory.

I dont cover every single one that task, while technically possible, would also be unproductive.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Ohh instead I said that the present Phillips. Wow.

But it's great and lives.

Meaningfully and thoughtful, like films and books, video games.

Why you darling?

Are cultural texts. They say something about when they were made, like improvements in gameplay and graphics. Video game narratives have also evolved and continue to do so. This evolution reveals our common cultural assumptions about what we consider to be plausible end of the world scenarios. Depending on when they were developed, that list includes nuclear war, alien invasion and outbreak narratives.

So you know, in terms of these three nuclear war, alien vision and outbreak narratives as plausible stories, right?

So they'll be a game where that happens plausibly. I mean, I guess the outbreak narrative is the most contemporary, right? You've got things like the Last of Us. Alright, the fungal outbreak.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

U most zombie films are based around an outbreak of some sort, I'd say um.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

But are we talking about films or just game?

Ohh well treated more broadly at this point, but it.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

OK, cause I'm thinking I'm thinking of the the plague Inc.

Yes. Yep, the Game Plague Inc, which is again. Yeah, another contagion game. Um. Yeah.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah. And then alien invasion, alien invasion. I mean, that's certainly reminds me of the 1950s. Well, I guess space invaders from 1970s video game. Um, any recent alien invasion?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, let's start with games.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Are you? An invitation. I can't think of any, to be perfectly honest at the moment. So the most recent game that I've bought, I've only bought one game in the last probably five years. Call of Duty Black Ops 6.

OK. Well, that's an infection. Game, isn't it?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, yeah, this is a zombie mine and playing zombie mode at the moment.

I mean the this a zombie mode.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Uh huh. All right. Okay. Well, I've just done a quick search, so we've got alien isolation. Alien invasion. I guess it is right like the alien. And have you played the crisis games crisis?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

One and two is that with like with a, why CRY?

Uh, yeah. See URY.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

No, no, haven't made it now.

Yeah, known for stunning graphics and intense gameplay. These games feature hostile alien species called the SEF. Halo is kind of alien invasion. Yeah, see Earth Defence Force series. I've played some of those Japanese game. It's basically a fun action series. The person you're shooting either in insects. Hell divers too, right? That's. Invasion. Mass Effect three, part of the acclaimed Mass Effect series. This game involves defending the Galaxy from massive alien threat Mass Effect 3 Alien Colonial Marines.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Of course you know another alien. One serious Sam. I've seen that in steam sales all the time. I've never picked it up. Yeah, uh, set in the universe of the alien.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

I don't know, but I.

No, sorry. That's alien clean, right? A fast paced shooter where you fight against alien overlords and their minions. So and nuclear invasion. So nuclear invasion. Video games. Any of those that's going to be fallout.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

And. Fallout 76. Fallout 1, Fallout 2, fallout, fallout.

Yeah. 4 Various Metro series you played the Metro game.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

No, no I have. I haven't got that in my library though.

Yep, post apocalyptic Russia first person shooter in the Moscow metro system. The Wasteland series I think they're doing something with the Wasteland series now U happy Snappy G allows players to lead a group of survivors in a world devastated by nuclear conflict. This a stalker shadow of Chernobyl. Again, you always see those in the steam sales.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

It's takes place Chernobyl exclusion zone filled with mutants, anomalies and other hazards. The Last of Us, which they also put is a nuclear bunker. That's not A5. Yeah. Ohh. Drinking game for media membership ticket drink Craig mentioned chechi big TV and Yep, so OK, I think we've run through a list, so let's see how um Doctor William puts that together. Okay.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

That means is great.

Which players strive to save themselves?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Ohh far too brief history of the Apocalypse. It is an ancient Greek term, meaning an unveiling of that which is hidden. It goes hand in hand with eschatology, the theology of last things apocalyptic and escatological visions appear in most major religions, such as the good versus evil struggle of Zoroastrianism and Judaism's the book of Ezekiel.

OK. So yeah, that's the finding that key to Apocalypse. So it's. It's roots are revealing that which should be a lot revealed. And yeah, obviously, yeah. Within Christian dogma, there's the idea of the final apocalypse battle. Good versus evil.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Any other apocalypse? I mean, you are an endangered minister.

That would you.

Yeah. Online, ordained of course, close the door wondering.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

I can't think of any apocalypse things. I generally tend to stay away.

In training that.

From when you got Ragnarok from Viking mythology, right?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

And end times narrative there.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Then the only games I know are Call of Duty in Skyrim.

Well, you're Call of Duty has some some apocalyptic imagery. Yeah. Figure which one it is that has new killer bombs going off and they're like a like it's in the US and there's a kind of nuclear attack. You're in the helicopter.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, I don't know which one you're specifically talking about, but they generally tend to have Nuke town, which is a town that you go around and fight in in multiplayer.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

And then, yeah, and then at the end of that round, a nuke goes off.

Called Newtown. Ohh there we go. How does that help train uses surviving the nuclear apocalypse doesn't.

And then in Christianity, the Book of Revelations foretold of Armageddon, a showdown between Christ and Antichrist that would trigger the Millennium 1000 year reign of peace. Early American Christianity embraced millennialism, but by the late 19th century, most preachers had traded in their threats of worldly apocalypse for a more appealing message of personal salvation.

Not many video games, then.

After World War One, with its horrors of trench warfare, shell shock and chemical weapons. Science and technology came to represent for many a new Antichrist.

I mean, you had a little high. She, well, stuff coming up in that Inter war period and some of those would be in conversation with, I guess some of that World War 1 apocalyptic imagery. Yeah, that that triggered. And I mean, you had the German expressionist cinema, Nosferatu to um and murderer 1. And um.

In 1916, even before motion Pictures had sound, the Danish film the end of the world depicted the panic after a comet threatened apocalypse.

That interval period, the birds.

1930s Sci fi magazines such as amazing stories and Weird Tales presented paranormal or extraterrestrial causes of Armageddon, as did the 1938 radio broadcast of HG Wells. The war of the Worlds World War 2 replaced these meat.

Of the and again meet. Yeah, we're the Wilds.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Apocalypse. Yeah. Yeah. And that's that's that's it. That's the alien invasion of the three categories. You've got one of the primal alien invasion texts there, where the worlds as well as Orson Welles radio broadcast of it, which then caused people.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

To free back to the birds.

And if it is cooked movie?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

That isn't. Yeah, that is an apocalypse.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Sort of. One with the birds go crazy.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

So killing everyone.

Totally, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's it's not a lean invasion. Maybe. I mean, it's it a mutation or something, I mean, but it's a, it's a, it's definitely a outbreak narrative.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, this isn't something like that. Outbreak outbreak commands, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So it's a good text, yeah. And then I believe, but I think when we're still in the 1930s, yeah.

So the book, I don't know if it's based on a book, might have been earlier. Yeah, we're the world's also thinking HP Lovecraft. Stuff like mythology talking 1920s there.

Apocalyptic visions with a new real horrific weapon designed in Los Alamos, detonated in the Alamogordo desert and dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Yes, this. Is what we're talking now.

The atomic bomb became the new symbol of apocalypse. In the Cold War that followed, scientists developed thousands of far more powerful thermonuclear weapons, which turned biblical prophecies of fire and brimstone into real possibilities during the Cold War, escatological lore mixed with nuclear fears to create new apocalyptic visions. In the 1950s, a barrage of mutated giant insects, them the giant score. In Comic book Super Powers, Spiderman, X-Men and Sci Fi monsters. Godzilla barraged a youth culture increasingly fascinated with radioactivity.

Yeah. So you have that idea of nuclear imagery through radiation, that idea of radiation and as as a hot button topic, I guess as something in storytelling that then does something. So I guess for Godzilla, the idea being that nuclear tests.

Caused some mutation caused caused Godzilla 2 to exist coming to existence. Um, Spiderman? You answer comic books. You have the idea of the radioactive spider binding Peter Parker giving him his mutant powers. Um them? Have you seen the them 1950s? I think it's, it's said in Los Alamos or something. It's it's, it's these ants that get a radiated and.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

They become super super, yeah.

China X to begin.

And so that's radiation.

Um, yeah, yes. And and look Astro boy in a different way, right? So he's atom powered Astro boy from the 1950s comic manga that it's based on, again reflecting the the kind of interest in storytelling power that exposure to radiation causes, right?

Either you know mutations or superheroes.

Literature presented radioactive dangers with less camp. Neville shoots 1957 book on the beach. Red warned how drifting radioactivity from a limited nuclear war would kill survivors in the southern hemisphere.

Read this so we movie.

Walter Miller's 19.

And it's really interesting on this on the beach because of course it's it's primarily set in Australia is one of the last outposts that still has surviving human civilization.

But they're all slowly dying anyway. And the story goes of the this this US. Military force, which which had been in the area and which has stationed up in Australia. As as part of this last Survivor Group I am receiving this most code message from the US so they decide to go there because you know, maybe there's someone that survived, they get there and it's spoiler alert. It's it's a. It's a coke bottle that had been caught on a window sill. And like a a a blind and next to a most code set that had accidentally been as the wind comes, it would accidentally trigger the Morse code.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

This coke bottle would, yeah. So it's this really depressing, nihilistic view of survival.

You know, it's not a mutating, apocalyptic vision. It's just, you know, this very sad. You know, we've all got, you know, one or two years of life and we're all dead. Uh, in in literature.

59 Scifi Classic A canticle for Leibovitz told a tale of underground monks and above ground mutants in a dystopian post nuclear society. Harlan Ellison's short story and later the film a boy and his dog presented a similar apocalyptic scenario, as did numerous Sci Fi mag. Scenes with so many cultural reminders of atomic annihilation, it's not surprising that video games, a medium that still heavily borrows from film and literature, appropriated these ideas.

Yeah. So you sitting up the idea that you in the generation before video games, so if we're saying video game started like Atari moment once and 19. And that previous generation in the 50s and 60s that were creating TV shows and movies and books that were integrating and working around these ideas of radiation are going to to make gestures and basically coop them. Um, but that's pretty much all the time. We've got 453 can. Play a little bit more. Um. Well, we'll we'll cap it off. We'll see where this takes us. And then we'll we'll set it up as a cliffhanger for a future show.

Teen 80s. It was natural for video games to feature nuclear war as the cause of a global apocalypse. Preventing the apocalypse.

Well, this is not a new chapter, so we're going to have a look at preventing the apocalypse next time, and in the mean time, see if I mean, Steam actually has just started its sales. So see if you can pick up every nice solation crisis we're going to play all these games. Earth Defence Force series Mass Effect 3.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Or Call of Duty 6 and I'll team up with you.

Coach. Is your in name gamer name tag DJ TJ or is it OK Poppy verse?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

What's the point in for that series?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

The mentor. It meant what is your gamertag?

We have been here.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Ohh it's in cream.

Ohh, is that the name of it? That's pretty good name. It's in Korean. It's a search. It's in Korean in.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Thing and you can join up with Taylor Wasteland series. Yeah. And more so, shoes will be available on the podcast and other spaces.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

It would be on the podcaster on the website.

Probably it will be in the description field.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

OK. Yeah, sure.

Um, yeah. Next week we might pick up with that topic of nuclear preventions. Uh also, yeah, I noticed that for the next two days or so, if you've got Amazon Prime, you can watch the 1980s Matthew Broderick Film War games for free.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Have you seen the war games?

That's different from war games.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, the, the the 19.

No. Ohh, the Doctor Who.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

In the It's 70s telly.

Yeah, yeah, totally. Isn't that Patrick Troughton?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah. Isn't that one that got lost and only half?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah. One of the ones I got lost, yeah.

So what are you watching it like half cartoon?

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Half cartoon half.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Um, actually, it's one of those ones of any ever heard of, right? You know soldiers.

From throughout time and Earth being collected and they were all you know, in this war field and the best of the best of them going to get recruited into this mad aliens invasion force.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

What could go wrong? So we might bring that up next week as well.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Have you seen the gunfighters? William Hartnell putting on the worst American accent. Wow.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

As they they they they pretend to be in a, you know, in a gunfight.

Yeah. Actually, on an aside, I mean talking, ending the show with, you know, what's making you happy like they do in pop culture. Happy hour. What's making me happy now? I came across this bizarre mad trying this particular Doctor Who fans are doing. Yep. Where they. I feel that in the name of the guy that's doing it, basically he hates those animated versions. Yeah, right, he says. They complete trash, so he decided to get together a group of friends and they they they've done now a few episodes of series that have been lost.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

I'm in, true but.

So they just got the audio track that they've they've, they've basically used AI like one of those AI video game video generated. This to generate the the episodes.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

I mean, that's horrific in itself at this.

Ohh, you've gotta see it.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Alright, terrible.

No, no, it's really, yeah. But it's it's it's it's one of these things. It's called some praise from some community members in the Doctor Who community who love it.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

And and a lot of people trashing it. Just saying, you know, this is everything that's wrong about like stable diffusion view AI programme that it looks so dead faced and you're basically and what they've taken is William Hunt. All the actors faces. But they've done them as prompts to it seems to prompt them the the production. I mean, it's all fans are doing. It's meant to have some, you know, animated talent cleaning it up. But yeah, it's it's like like at points faces merged with guns and it's it's got all of the pitfalls that contemporary AI generated.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Some of it you know, proof of concept does suggest wow, like it could. It could be something that gets done. We're basically you're you're, you're. You're recapturing that series again. As it would have been filmed, but then using a I to to to construct it. But yeah, with the quality of like they're basically using off the shelf stuff you can get on a web browser to create.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

So it's it's. Yeah, and yeah, you can see a couple of React videos. Fans have an YouTube, there's a couple of react years with fans are just critiquing the all that's wrong with AI at the moment through this piece.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

But yeah, one of them that they did is the Highlanders.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Alright, OK. Yeah.

Alright. Um, yeah. So I'll show it to you later anyway, so check that out.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Better just did the audio adventures.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Yeah, we'll do.

It seems that seems to be the safest.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Adventures are good, some of them are.

Alright, well it's 459. We will end there because we're about to go into Cape Jpop Kpop verse. Now what's it called again? Kpop unlimited.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

With DJ laces memorable DJ.

Well, you know, possibly go go together a little smoother than today's show for me.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Maybe, hopefully.

Um, yeah. So, uh TuneIn next week. Where? Yeah, if all the technology works, will.

TAYLOR LIDSTONE

Drive down into that a bit further. That's me, medium ownership for another week here on Edge Radio. 91.3 FM. I've been doctor Craig.

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