Episode 79 - With host Craig Norris and Taylor Lidstone.
First Broadcast on Edge Radio, 28th June 2024.
In this episode, we dive into the fascinating world of audio-only gaming with a spotlight on “A Blind Legend.” Experience a unique segment where we play a part of the game on-air, showcasing its innovative use of binaural sound. As well as news around Final Fantasy 14:Dawntrail tourism, AI fails, Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes special Blu-ray feature, and the Full Metal Jacket artwork backlash.
Listen here:
Links
Final Fantasy 14: Dawntrail Tourism Site Is A Hilarious Delight (kotaku.com)
The Lyrics of Natalie Portman’s ‘SNL’ Rap Were Cited as Fact in a Newspaper Article About Her | Cracked.com
Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes’ Blu-ray shows off actors without VFX - Polygon
Full Metal Jacket Artwork to Be Restored on Prime Video After Matthew Modine Backlash - IGN
Listen live to “Media Mothership” every Friday 4-5pm (Australian Eastern Standard Time) via YouTube, Twitch, and Edge Radio.
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TRANSCRIPT
This is an AI-generated transcript of the audio and it may contain errors. We may update or correct this transcript in the future. Please contact us if you have any questions about the information in this transcript. The audio is the official record of this episode.
CRAIG NORRIS
Welcome. Welcome to media mothership broadcasting out of Edge Radio Studios here in ******, Lunar Hobart TAS and on media membership, we explore how media can shape our understanding of the world. Around us, I'm your host. Doctor Craig Ford. PC joined by. Yeah, we'll go with Lord. I'm trying to think. What was the one where you got ordained minister? Yeah. Yeah. Ordained minister Taylor. Yeah. Father. Father Taylor. Yeah. And of course, as always, we're streaming on edgeradio.org dot AU as well as YouTube and Twitch. You can find us just by searching media mothership. We're also, of course streaming out or playing out on the digital DAB network. You can message us on the chat at YouTube or Twitch or SMS US on 0488811707. Today's topic. We're going to look at some unusual news around media and then we're going to dive into video games which only. Use audio to play them through. So all that and more on media, Mothership, Edge radio. 99.3 first story is on. Final Fantasy Final Fantasy was reported in Kotaku, so Final Fantasy of course, well known video game series set in a fantasy.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, the final one.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yes, that's nice. Not well. Give him up to #14. It's a little misleading in terms of they'll, they'll. The Final Fantasy wasn't the last one, obviously. Sorry, that must be a joke that all the Final Fantasy guys.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Right. Well, like, do you know how it came up with that name? No. Tell me. Well, I don't know if this is true or not, but it's what I read in a magazine about 20 years ago. It was that the IT was square. So.
Speaker 4
Really.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
The the gaming company was it's called square. Yep, and they. We're basically failing and they said we're going to make one Final Fantasy and see if it works and it worked.
CRAIG NORRIS
Really. So they did pitch it. As you know, this is potentially the last piece of work that might occur.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Before the goes under, yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
In this company and you know, again it became prophetic, prophetic, I guess in a way that this Final Fantasy series was enormously successful. So we're up to #14 Dawn trails.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
So that's the expansion pack of it. So Final Fantasy 14 is the online version of the game, and it's had six or seven expansions over time, and this is the newest one that's come out. So it will cover new area, new items, new characters.
CRAIG NORRIS
The reason this slept out at me was that the, UM reasonably well known actor Reese Stabby. Is appearing in the advertising around it now we starve. I. You might remember from series.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Like the Conchords?
CRAIG NORRIS
We have fly the Conchords, we replace the New Zealand. Cultural ambassador or something in the states?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Or if if you don't, if you're not not familiar with New Zealand comedy, then probably people would know him from Jumanji. The.
CRAIG NORRIS
Jim. Mark. That's right. Yeah, the which one is it that he's in? Not the Robin Williams original.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
No, no, no, just the the new version as it's sort of like the.
CRAIG NORRIS
Then. The guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When you go into that Jumanji online game world, he pops in as the host NPC. Yeah. He's also in a flag min staff. I've seen a few options of that. The The Pirate one looked like bit. So that jumped out at me because what they've set up here.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Start up. MPC. Oh yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Is a fake tourism website. I'm always interested in tourism and media where where people you know will travel to a real location. In fact, last week's episode was with Windy and Nick from Edge radios, mental connections and their own journeys to like Disneyland theme parks as well as. Cardiff to see Doctor Who sat tour and they brought in there their photo album of that. So so it's worth checking out.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh yeah. What the photo album?
CRAIG NORRIS
Well, we did put it on the camera.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
OK.
Speaker 4
A little bit so.
CRAIG NORRIS
Do you check that out on YouTube? This in this case though, it's it's the. Other way around where that? Where you can't go to this world, the Final Fantasy world that this is depicting. But they've set it up as if it is a tourist location. You can come. Is it so? It's as you're saying. This is the the the download. So this is launching today, June 28th. Warriors of light. At least for those who pre-ordered early access.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh wow. So so all so all of the people who are diehard fans and would want to know this information aren't listening to this programme because.
CRAIG NORRIS
They're already playing, potentially took a day off work, and they're exploring now. The new world of. Val in Final Fantasy 14 latest expansion, so down trail is set to be a they're saying is a summer vacation journey for players. Which would be great. From the Southern hemisphere, definitely to summer vacation, which?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Is a sort. Of reward after completing a decades long story with end. Walker, do you know anything about a decades long story with end Walker?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I mean, I've played it, but I haven't played it all the way through or even.
CRAIG NORRIS
Played it much an end. Walker was one of the Final Fantasy things potentially. So in anticipation of what Terrell has to offer from today on, Square Enix has given the tropical location. Look how its own tourism website featuring actor Reese Darby. So we're going to play a short clip of it as Darby is performing in character as a kind of helpful guide, letting players know what they can expect in this world. And he's playing the role of this intern, interim interim deputy Director of tourism. OK, right. So said in Tural and Choralis M. It's the poor joke they've they've. Delivered there. All right, so let's listen now. Yeah, I'm curious to see how how it lands. That's just got the loading window.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Uh, brilliant.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yeah, yeah. I'm confident it will.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
OK, we're we're still going. Save more with everyday rewards.
CRAIG NORRIS
Alright. Very lagging. Could be because I've got a little too many programmes open this laptop.
Speaker 5
Yeah, pretty good.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Just listen to three second bites.
Speaker 4
Ohh dear.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Well, that's a bust.
CRAIG NORRIS
Why is why? Why is it so poorly? Ohh, let me see.
Speaker
Ah greetings as my first act.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Wow. Yeah. Wow.
CRAIG NORRIS
See, I tried to cheese.
Speaker
As interim deputy director of terrorism, I'd.
CRAIG NORRIS
Like to welcome you to. Yeah, OK. I tried to cheese clips. You're gonna have some nice audio to play. Sometimes it's my downfall, right? Yeah. All right. But yeah. OK. So cute little idea there in terms of rolling out a tourism campaign, providing information, at least, you know, I mean, there's a couple of things circulating around media and tourism. There's the fact that the Steve Irwin's family. So obviously not Steve Irwin. The wife and kids were down in Tasmania and it got reported in the US as their visit to Tanzania.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yes, I saw that.
CRAIG NORRIS
One, yeah. And so that unleashed all this memes about, you know, like it was one that the I think did of the Tasmanian ambulances spotted in Tanzania promoting service. So it's important to get tourism right locations of the world.
Speaker 6
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
Even when it falls over Dash, so. All right, so the next article that I found that was quite interesting, I just.
Speaker 4
Tonight.
CRAIG NORRIS
You was for those that were listening to the show before we started, you would have heard Natalie Portman's Saturday Night Live Rap. This was a rap where she kind of lampooned her position as a kind of good girl. At that point. I think in her career she had just done the Star Wars movies as a Princess Padme or Queen Padme.
Speaker 6
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
And this rap she did on Saturday Night Live was very much kind of turning the tables on that. Portrayal of her, you know, in in fact it's it's been referred to as a mind bogglingly graphically filthy hip hop track that she performs where she drops innumerable F bombs and she threatens to slip the throat of poor nitrous and poor nitrous down the hole. So it's it's a wonderful way of her to. Lampoon this idea of the the good girl that sheds that that image and embraces a bad girl character. What's fascinating is this was reported in Cracked ecom, the lyrics of Natalie Portman's SNL rap were cited as fact in a newspaper article. About her. This was in the Daily Mail, the UK Daily Mail, and they were reporting on it as a real fact. What's interesting, as I was looking into it because it got picked up. Through X, people started posting that. Clearly the Daily Mail had no idea what they're reporting on here, and they're alleged. Kind of hard hitting investigation of surprising celebrities who still smoke cigarettes through which they mentioned Natalie Portman.
Speaker
As.
CRAIG NORRIS
Celebrity that does this, but their evidence was based on the song lyrics from the Saturday Night Live Sketch. Yeah, but they mentioned the fact that, yeah, in the song where, well, they didn't mention his lyrics. Did just say Portman was big into weed and cocaine while she was at college? It was just part of a satirical performance she was delivering and their evidence to again support their article was that she made a statement, forgetting that it was actually a song lyric where she says I smoked weed every day and she did every test and snorted all the white. Yay. So anyway, it's really interesting. They're pulling this apart, but then people began to suspect that this article has probably been AI generated.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Right. OK. Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Right. It hasn't been officially confirmed, but a lot of people after they started satirising how badly. The daily. The daily purse the Daily Mail had screwed up their reporting on this as fact when it was complete fiction. They they felt that that you know. Presumably this was probably generated from an AI because all of their statements were clearly based on evidence, right? In terms of, there were lyrics in their song, but any human that did a Google search. Found and found this alleged evidence. We also realise it's song. It's a song lyric. So they're suspecting that that surely no human would be able to do this badly. It must be an AI who, as they argue in this article, yanked the initial statement from the observer piece because they said there is. A 2011 profile appointment in the Observer. Which featured the fact that she did this rap song and the lyrics, but again, you know, describing it as satire. So the AI probably landed on that observer piece, treated it as. Straightforward news, didn't contextualise it as a song, and then reported it as as real and then known at the Daily Mail. Checked it. It's interesting though that that you know, initial laughter at Daily Mail for not knowing it's a satirical song. And then the kick in around, you know, I wonder if this has just been even lazier than that, whether it's just been an AI generated an article. Which they've you know. Polished to a minimal degree and they've been busted potentially. For that as. Well, so yeah, interesting. I mean interesting in terms of the critique of journalism today, that not only is a paper here being critiqued for not fact checking, but also potentially for making such an outrageously. Bad lack. Fact checking that the only other side it could possibly have come from was an article which contextualised as as spherical music. But and I I probably would have missed that fact.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
MHM. It seems AI generated to me looking at how it's written.
CRAIG NORRIS
So to move, move on to the next piece. The next article I want to talk about takes is it shows how important it is to be transparent. So it's the latest planet of the Apes film Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes, and this interested me. This is being reported in in Polygon and it's titled Every Blu-ray should come with Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes. Best special feature we deserve the pre CSGO version of every movie. And what the article goes on to talk about is how this latest Kingdom of the. Planet of the Apes. Movie is very visual effects heavy. That is of course you know you've got a lot of motion capture actors that are then being CG's to look like gorillas and apes and monkeys.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
And it's, you know, a claimed level of CEI what's and and as they point out in the article, there's only two human characters in it. So heavy CGI. But this article is praising the fact that when. You if you if. You watch the Blu-ray, there's a special on it called the Raw cut, which presents it as a split screen version of the whole movie where on one side it's the finished film. Where you've got the full special effects and the other side is. Without special effects or without the CGI put on top of it, and it's just the actors and the motion capture suits that you're watching, deliver their lines and so forth. And it's really interesting unpacking of that. Yeah, the guys talking about how, you know, first, it's kind of awkward seeing how fake it is and how let's pretend this is real.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
Is challenging and if your reviewer you have zero suspension of disbelief because it's like you know it's just green screen and the guy with ping pong balls. On him, yeah. But he's actually saying it's fantastic. Because you do get to. Get that level of media literacy. Yeah, you see how signal. To get that computer technology is to transform this scene into a startling, arresting, realistic portrayal of apes, yeah. Which would be. A lot of fun, you know, people talking about how you know, Andy Serkis's performance from Golan. Could possibly have been presented in that way. It's interesting, I think, because he's he was never awarded an. Like at the Oscars, there was this debate whether his performance would be entitled.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Ohh right, yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Early on with that First Lord of the Rings film, is that a performance that entitles him to be nominated? And I I think at the time the decision was no, that that doesn't count as acting, and since then they've been able to either.
Speaker 7
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
Create a award category 4 actors performing through CGI, but I know there's been been a change in that. But yeah, the the raw cut again, it's interesting those moments where it shows you how media gets created and how you can understand the the material that's there. So yeah, would you be interested in? Watching a movie that has. The split screen.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Especially one with Andy Serkis in it.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, cause. I'm thinking you could watch. Which? I mean, the other films which get a lot of maybe eye rolling about the use of CGI would be the Star Wars prequels, where those are seen to detract from the storytelling in a way that it looks very difficult to perform in that environment. Yet it seems that, yeah, circuses, involvements in films.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Been acclaimed for the fact that, you know his performance and the way the director has been able to create those. Performances is really captivating, so it would be fascinating. The next story continues the idea of movies. This is at the other end of movies where kind of presenting the movie is a failure. So this is from ign.com. There's an article here, the title being full metal jacket artwork to be restored on Prime Video after Matthew Modine. Backlog. This is the born to kill phrase. Had no longer appeared on private jokers here. Helmet in the thumbnail for the movie so on. Amazon Prime Video it's one of those streaming services and what what I like about this is it's the actor that. Performed the role. Which the helmet he wore in the movie ended up being one of the iconic elements to the movie poster, and it was used in in this case the thumbnail. Now the initial. Movie. So here's. So it's performed by Matthew Modine. There's a quote here. He posted it up when he he noticed it on Amazon. He posted up a quote on a message on X saying who decided to remove born to kill. So if you see the original image of the helmet, it's inside profile. And it's one of these U.S. Army helmets. And on one side it's got born to kill, written in magic marker. Then there's a peace symbol and some some ammunition strapped to it. And in the Amazon version, though, the born to kill riding has been removed. So Matthew reading posted this question saying who decided to remove born to kill. Not only did they alter a piece of iconic art. By Philip Castle, but they completely misunderstood the point of it being that private Joker, who's the character Matthew Bidean, plays in full metal jacket. Private Joker wears the helmet with born to kill and the peace button as a statement about the duality of man. Have you ever seen that scene in?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
For mental jacket? No, I've never heard of it before. I don't know what it's about. I assume it's about. Well, full metal jacket. That's some sort of. Isn't that like some sort of bullet? Is a full metal jacket or something?
CRAIG NORRIS
Yes. Yeah. So so it refers, I think to the casing the the metal casing that the ammunition is is housed within, for, for rifles. And so I'll play you the scene where Matthew Media's character, Private Joker, is confronted by. Captain or major, and asked to explain what he's got on his helmet. OK.
Speaker 4
MHM.
Speaker 5
Born to kill, Sir.
CRAIG NORRIS
I'll go back.
Speaker 5
You're right.
Speaker 6
Everybody turned up, got shot. Somebody buried alive. Right, Colonel?
Speaker 5
Green. What is that button on your body?
Speaker 6
Armour, a peace symbol, Sir.
Speaker 5
Where'd you get it? I don't remember, Sir. What is that you've got written on? Your helmet born to kill Sir. You write born to kill on your helmet and you wear a peace button. What's that supposed to be? Some. Kind. Of sick joke? No Sir. Is it supposed? Me.
Speaker
I don't know, Sir.
Speaker 5
You don't know very much, Julia. No, Sir. You better get your head in your *** wired together, or I will take. Your giant **** on. You. Yes, Sir. To answer my question. Or you'll be standing tall. Before the man. I think I was trying to suggest something about the duality of man, Sir. The what the duality of man, the youngin thing, Sir. Whose side are you on? On our side, Sir, would you love your country? Yes, Sir. How about getting with the programme? Why don't you jump on the team and come on? In for the big. Win. Yes, Sir, son, all I've ever asked of my Marines is for them to obey my orders as they would the word of God. We are here to help the Vietnamese. Because inside every **** there is an American trying to get out. It's a hardball world, son. We've got to try to keep our heads until this peace craze blows over.
Speaker
Aye, Sir.
CRAIG NORRIS
Durability of man. It's a union thing.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
So it's it's this. Critical part of the movie, it's considered one of the the kind of classic quotes that came out of full metal jacket. There's a number of them and.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Is it a comedy? It sounds like a comedy.
CRAIG NORRIS
There, there are aspects of it which could be considered. Elements of black comedy, but it's yeah, it's it's it's quite an arresting dramatic war film as well. It's by Stanley Kubrick, of course. So it it it.
Speaker 4
OK.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Don't know who. That is really.
CRAIG NORRIS
Well, look, I I've never played Final Fantasy, so I I can't be too outraged, but yeah, Stanley Kubrick's considered absolute genius as a filmmaker. 2001 space odyssey.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
OK, fair enough.
CRAIG NORRIS
Clockwork Orange. Are two of the most significant films, of course.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Is he the angry American fellow? He's.
CRAIG NORRIS
British.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh, he's the angry American fellow because I don't like him. He's the one that does Jango Unchained.
CRAIG NORRIS
Ohh Quentin Tarantino, OK.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, that's what I hate. OK. So I might like this.
CRAIG NORRIS
Show criticism here at its best media mothership. Yeah, so it's it's one of these fascinating own goals within advertising, where I assume much like this kind of desire not to offend anyone. Who knows why? They would remove born to kill. Potentially. Yeah, a a kind of nervous risk averse reaction that Amazon had. But you know it it it also fails to recognise the the type of artwork that goes in to create these images and poster.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
Up and that it also kind of. Pieces of the fan base, right? So of course, Amazon has since reversed this. Hmm. Because of the huge outcry about the silliness and pettiness of removing it, and the complete tone deafness of why the initial decision was made that.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, it's very strange because given the amount of rubbish that there is on on the show. Which they show in the little what's it called the thumbnail, thumbnail. Why they decided to remove that, which isn't particularly offensive, I guess. And, but you can tell from the picture that they have gone in and. Taken the original and purposefully edited the words out.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yes, yes. Crazy. So yes, that's that's a bit of of of media. All right, now we're going to take going to take risks.
Speaker
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
The big risks on the show? Well, what I'm interested in trying to perform live on radio is a a video game.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Dissection.
CRAIG NORRIS
No. Nothing that's grisly. I've been thinking a lot about how to incorporate aspects of making media while we're doing media mothership. So in the past, we've done AI radio dramas where we've got groups that we've. Worked with AI to create like your info. Harry Potter and the looming pumpkins blowing pumpkins. Something about pumpkins. And there was the Sherlock Holmes and Doctor Watson ones. It was interview with a I freaking pumpkins.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Why is it infamous? Screeching pump screeching.
CRAIG NORRIS
You can check those episodes out. I'll put links to them if I can find them in the show notes. We've also played some great music you've created through AI. Add your own skills as well. Now what I'm curious about doing is. Attempting to discuss and analyse how video games work through controllers. Mm-hmm. And the significance of failure in playing a video game. So one of the things that really interests me about playing video games is you have those. There's an interesting article by Jasper Jules who argues that. There's there's a contradiction at the heart of video gaming, which is that one hand you've got this drive to win, right? So. People will talk about their the the pleasure of winning the video game. They they play the video game to win it. It's immensely satisfying to win the video game, but then on the other hand, you've got the idea that the game should be challenging, right? It should be something that you have to devote some time and effort to win at. Yeah, which means you have to lose sometimes so that you can then. Learn how to beat the game so these are contradictions, because if you only really wanted to win, then you'd just find the easiest game possible and just do that all the time. Like I I I just want that dopamine hit, so I'll just go for this easy level or I'll play the game at the easiest possible settings. But the interesting thing is when you play the game.
Speaker 6
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
The easiest settings possible. You'll get bored out of your brain. It just will not be at all satisfying. And so there must be that experience of failure within playing the game. And you know, there's been much research done on that, that kind of middle that you want to get into the flow, right? You want to be both challenged, right? So there's. If you're needing to put in, you need to concentrate you needing to to develop strategies to overcome the challenges of the game, but not. Not punishing enough that you feel that you. It's just arbitrary as to whether you win or not. Yeah, that people say it's satisfying to lose when it's my fault. And when I know what I did wrong, it's not satisfying to lose when it's just arbitrary and it's just to roll the dice. And nothing I could have done could have changed that. And. Madlock right, that can really annoy gamers, and they'll say the game is broken because this just happened and it's so fun.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
So. With that in mind, I'm curious to see about how we can play one of these audio games. I've not played this one, so this is called a blind legend. So I looked for suggestions on what video games are out there which only use audio, right? So to do this on air at Edge radio. I wanted to find a video game that could just be played through audio. So blind legend is one that came up quite a lot as quite an interesting game that has this mechanic which relies entirely on sound to convey the games environments, the narrative and the mechanics. Right. So we're going to be interested to see if we can what that challenge is like to play a game without any visuals. And and and if and that question of accessibility as well, right. So. These type of games are considered to be very accessible in terms of even visually impaired players, can engage with them. Is that still challenging or is it? Is it kind of made simplified for that or is it in fact more challenging for a gamer to just use one sense which is? So we're going to give it a go and we're going to see what types of sound cues this uses, like, how does the mechanic work, what? How does sound cues and audio based interactions work for me to navigate this game in what kind of puzzles. As it's set up, how do I engage with characters just through audio? Does I mean and and I'm? I'm going to do a caveat that that if the game kind of comes to a grinding halt, it has more to do with me and probably says more about my. Own gaming abilities. Than the game itself, and I might pass it on. To. To Father Taylor to to to give it a shot. But we're looking for is. Yeah. Is there an immersive experience that we're going to get into as we're playing this game as listeners are? Are you finding it engaging and immersive to to listen to and the the challenge here is that.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
OK.
CRAIG NORRIS
To best engage with blind mirror blind legends are you.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Blind mirror like Black Mirror.
CRAIG NORRIS
Blind legend, you need to use what's called the engage with what what's called the binaural audio or 3D sound techniques.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh yeah, yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
So that you've got to have headphones or they suggest headphones. So something where there's a left and right hearing so that you've got the mechanics based on this idea of the sense of direction and space. That you're hearing through your left and right headphone. That gets you to see through your ears. So, so in radio that referred to this as theatre of the mind. Right. So you should be able to, in your mind, see the play that's that's occurring because obviously there will be a complete absence of any visual elements that are going to help us. It's just going to be the audio design that's going to get us to engage with the story and hopefully guide me as the player. So it's going to be interesting how an audio only. Games such as this. Could be considered maybe more inclusive because you don't need to see to be able to play it. There's not many types of games like this, unfortunately, but the hope is that there will be games developed to offer more engagement to this. Wider audience. So we're going to try and look at it in terms of what type of interactivity and engagements there. How is the experience mediated through vocal instructions only? Is it satisfying, right? Is are we going to feel satisfied with the deeper engagement by using the mechanical only our ears and the keyboard? It's it's it's. Well, I I won't tell much more about it. I'll, I'll. I'll boot it up and we'll.
Speaker 7
OK.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, bleed it up.
CRAIG NORRIS
We'll, we'll, we'll we'll see what it's like.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Booted up. See what it's.
CRAIG NORRIS
Like. Yeah. Yeah. Have you ever played an audio only video game? No. No, you're right. It's about to find out. I'm. Yeah. So we're going to play it from the start.
Speaker 7
We're.
Speaker 8
Supported by the Centre national anime La Reggie and Romeo, Humanist and Imagino.
CRAIG NORRIS
AI voice.
Speaker 8
Present.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK.
Speaker 8
A blind legend.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK.
Speaker 8
Loading.
Speaker 4
Yep.
Speaker 8
Welcome to a blind legend main menu. Continue a game to go back to the main menu from the game press escape.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK, I think we can just press enter.
Speaker 8
Loading OK, loading OK, so we're in.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Wow, what does it show on? The screen just smoke. Ohh.
Speaker 7
Where are we going, father?
Speaker 9
We must cross the plain to reach the forest and enter into thoughts Kingdom.
Speaker 5
Hurry up. The storm is close.
Speaker 7
Let's go.
CRAIG NORRIS
All right. So I think that's my. Daughter. OK, So what I'm doing is I'm just pressing the up button and the move right button on the.
Speaker 7
Straight ahead.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Keyboard oh OK.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yeah. And we can hear, Senator, I like the sound effect of. The storm? Yeah. And you can hear the daughter. Telling me what to do, so obviously I meant to walk close to where her voice is straight ahead. So I'm.
Speaker 7
Great.
CRAIG NORRIS
Just going straight now.
Speaker 7
Right.
CRAIG NORRIS
Turn right.
Speaker 4
So I'm just.
Speaker 7
It's behind you.
CRAIG NORRIS
Hitting behind me, so I'll go backwards. Move to the right. Got to be close.
Speaker 7
Yeah, what do?
CRAIG NORRIS
I I. Move. To the right a bit more.
Speaker 4
OK.
Speaker 7
You're really close.
CRAIG NORRIS
Really close and I can hear the voice. I mean, it does actually get louder. Yeah, get close.
Speaker 8
Thank you.
CRAIG NORRIS
Turn around.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Come on.
CRAIG NORRIS
How do I turn around? I'll try. Going the other. Way. OK, left. I'm going. Left. Turn right and turn right.
Speaker 7
It's behind you. It's a Cliff.
CRAIG NORRIS
Behind me, I'm getting behind. Right.
Speaker 4
Going straight ahead.
Speaker 7
Come on, father, you're close.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK. I think I can just keep my finger. On the button. I don't, I don't know. If it. Helps. OK, right.
Speaker 7
Right.
CRAIG NORRIS
Because I don't know if you meant to. Hit it more times.
Speaker 4
Left. OK.
CRAIG NORRIS
Like the store behind. I'm feeling like I really just want to get in there now and do the next part. Are we in the thing yet? What are we doing again? We're going to.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Shelter. I think so.
CRAIG NORRIS
Feels like I've been outside for a long time. I am to the right. I'm going to. OK, I'm going to tap it now. So now I'm tapping.
Speaker 4
Right.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I think you only need to do it once and. Then. Go ahead. OK, let's do.
Speaker 4
That left and then. Now I'm going straight.
Speaker 7
Yeah. You're really close.
Speaker
OK.
CRAIG NORRIS
Let's go. I'm going to tap now.
Speaker 7
Straight ahead. The phone OK.
Speaker 10
Bad back.
Speaker 5
Here we go.
Speaker 8
To draw out or put away your sword, press enter.
CRAIG NORRIS
Source in the back got my short.
Speaker 8
To slice through an obstacle in front of you, press up.
Speaker 4
Look at what I'm doing. Wow.
CRAIG NORRIS
I'm slicing through. All of this. That's good sound effects. Yeah, I like.
Speaker 4
The the sword.
Speaker
We need a shelter.
Speaker 9
Can you see anything?
Speaker 7
There on the right, The Cave.
Speaker 5
Hey.
CRAIG NORRIS
Well, you know the sound effect design. Is pretty good.
Speaker 7
Yes.
CRAIG NORRIS
I'm just going to get to The Cave.
Speaker 7
Behind you.
Speaker 4
Do you want that?
CRAIG NORRIS
OK, you you wanna try it for a SEC, alright.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I'm getting way too frustrated to.
CRAIG NORRIS
I'm gonna ask. Me. Just just try for a for a little.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Bit. OK, OK. There is just like on the screen.
CRAIG NORRIS
So.
Speaker 7
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
The voice sounds like it's coming from the lamp.
Speaker 5
OK.
CRAIG NORRIS
Behind.
Speaker 7
Over here.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK, now let's go, I think. Are you keeping your finger on? The button or you?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, keeping it on.
Speaker 4
Oh, what's that?
CRAIG NORRIS
Sounds like you're walking really slow.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I know.
CRAIG NORRIS
OK, we're in The Cave, I hear Nick.
Speaker 7
Ah.
CRAIG NORRIS
That's really good.
Speaker 7
This way. Now come closer to me. All right.
Speaker 8
Loading.
CRAIG NORRIS
All right. Well, I think we did the.
Speaker 4
1st chapter. Wow.
CRAIG NORRIS
Was that?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Good radio. Well, I think so.
CRAIG NORRIS
I don't know if I could do a let's play.
Speaker
Father.
CRAIG NORRIS
Entirely on this loading. Sorry, I'll just hit escape now.
Speaker 8
Welcome to a blind legend main menu. Continue a game to go back to the main menu from the game.
CRAIG NORRIS
I mean, yeah. OK, I just quit. I'm I I'm interested because. Yeah, look, I mean, you you sometimes I'll go onto YouTube and people will be doing a let's play. And I'll I'll happily watch along with it. Yeah, it is challenging. Just doing it with audio and doing it. Let's play because it does feel like.
Speaker 6
MHM.
CRAIG NORRIS
Like. You know there's. The audio has to do so much heavy lifting for it to be engaging and interesting.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
And I did find it. Frustrating to to get the controls right. It really is tough to base your movements on the sound only and and you quickly become a little frustrated. I'm sure after a while you'd get better at.
Speaker 7
Yeah.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
It and it's the fact that you don't know whether when you turn, whether it's turning on a four point or an 8 point or a 16. Point.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yeah, I was confused that the mechanics or the controller in terms of am I meant to hold my finger down and does that keep turning or do I do it once? And yeah, as you're saying, if I if I go left, am I turning left? So eventually I'll turn back to the front or am I actually moving horizontally left. Yeah. So I was a little confusing. I mean, it seemed like we got the hang of it.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm. We got to The Cave.
CRAIG NORRIS
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, well, we might return to that, you know, feel free to to message in if you want us to keep playing that.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I had fun. 102888117.
CRAIG NORRIS
07 I'll assume that no messages mean. Yes, double down. We've got about 7 minutes left. What I want to do is go through some classic video game sounds. This was from wide.com. They did a piece recently with four video game sound designers explaining the thinking behind some of the world's most recognisable. Video game sounds. So we're going to hear Pacman, Sonic the Hedgehog, Donkey Kong, Mario Kart, Contra, Street Fighter, two Doom more.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh, cool, yeah. Oh, you're just giving it all. Away.
CRAIG NORRIS
I don't. You don't know what order it is. I just throw people in the zone. So I'll. I'll play a bit of the audio. I'll stop it and we'll try to guess what it is and then we'll hear what the experts say.
Speaker 7
OK.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Mario.
CRAIG NORRIS
This is just a compilation.
Speaker 7
Jobs done.
CRAIG NORRIS
There you go. Poem. Yes, this is poem, that kind of.
Speaker 4
Hearing.
CRAIG NORRIS
Is the very first. This is the. Very first video game I think.
Speaker 9
Pong. Yeah the 1st.
Speaker 10
Video game in those days, the programmers created the sounds.
Speaker 9
I think they wanted to create an audience and cheers and at the end they were just left with the tone.
Speaker 10
Definitely limited to the waveforms they could.
Speaker 9
Make they didn't have samples, so they had a chip that made sounds.
Speaker 10
They could only. Me. Get up to a certain pitch because that took some horsepower away from the rest of the game.
Speaker 11
People have probably heard that sound 10s of thousands of times, and it's one little tone amazing.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Oh.
Speaker 4
Really good. Yeah.
Speaker 11
Going.
CRAIG NORRIS
And you hear how it's getting louder. It's not soft slow.
Speaker 11
Going into cardiac arrest.
Speaker 9
It starts creating tension.
Speaker 12
Inside a bunch of games you're about to run out of time. So what do they? Do they make the music playback faster? That's one of the tricks. Change rhythm.
Speaker 9
This.
Speaker 10
To change speed, that sound increasing in frequency.
Speaker 11
He timed that to the human heartbeat.
Speaker 10
It's around 60 beats per minute that.
CRAIG NORRIS
Something like so. It's really interesting. Space Invaders that as we know, it's that horizontal scrolling. Alien spaceships above you. You're in a rocket ship down the bottom or a gun down the bottom and you're firing between these little kind of cover positions to hopefully wipe out the space invaders? The aliens. But as they get closer to you, their speed increases. Not only the speed, but of course the sound. So it's so interesting to hear. That he based it on the heartbeat to begin with. I guess it's boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom and then. Increases so that.
Speaker 11
That sound got quicker. His or her heart rate was being affected as well.
Speaker 10
That was probably the first time a bit of psychoacoustics was finding its way into game design.
CRAIG NORRIS
Psycho acoustics. I love that we should.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
And that was.
CRAIG NORRIS
Hype, man. God dammit. Good. Yeah. How did you? That was just me saying of it.
Speaker
There's no.
CRAIG NORRIS
I was gonna say we should do psychoacoustics, right? If we can get one of those AI. Music makers. Mm-hmm. And you can put prompts in Psycho Acoustics. Yeah. Is a key term. Alright. So then back into it.
Speaker 10
Time a bit of psychoacoustics was finding its way into game design waka waka.
Speaker 12
It's the sound of insatiability.
Speaker 11
The name of the game was called Puckman.
Speaker 9
We started with the tone and now we modulate it, so it's not really.
CRAIG NORRIS
Language warning. It gives an explanation as to, so it's weird, right? And then the comments people have pointed this out that the PAC man, the discussion of PAC Man is really interesting, right? It talks about that, that sound effects sound, how they they developed it. One of the four experts spends all the time talking about how the original name from Japan was paku.
Speaker
Yeah.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
Man Pu CK man or PUK man PUC man anyway. And inevitably it led to teenagers. Yeah. So language warning here as he explains that joke.
Speaker 7
Hmm.
Speaker 6
Thank you.
Speaker 11
When? Brought that over to the United States. Teenagers at the time thought it would be funny if they kind of blocked out the curvature of the pee.
Speaker 10
As the PAC man's biting it, it it, the sound mimicked that so closely. ****, man.
Speaker 9
In the day you can hear it in a restaurant or bar and and you know exactly what it was.
Speaker 11
And so they changed it from Pacman to PAC man.
CRAIG NORRIS
What do you reckon?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
It's familiar. I can't think of what it is.
Speaker 11
To PAC man.
Speaker 9
They wanted to create a certain amount of.
CRAIG NORRIS
Donkey Kong.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Ah, OK. Motion with doggy Kong. I've never played that.
Speaker 12
There's this almost targeting to the way that cartoon sounds behave.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
One before. That's why I didn't know.
Speaker 9
So it's a little bit of Carl stalling the composers to all the bugs buddy Flintstones off. That's all wood blocks and he's.
CRAIG NORRIS
So interesting how they're explaining that Donkey Kong sound as evoking cartoon sounds from the 50s, right? the OR 60s the you know. Trying to think of Bugs Bunny Flintstone stuff? Yeah.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 9
Orchestras then cause sound effects, weren't there?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
I don't think I've never. Heard that one before.
Speaker 4
Yeah. Anything. Let's. Let's come up.
Speaker 10
I've heard, but I can't identify.
Speaker 7
Beep beep.
Speaker 10
Ohh that OK defender.
CRAIG NORRIS
Defender defender sounds like a kind of synth vibe, right? You could sample that.
Speaker 11
Probably had the most complex sounds. To that point.
Speaker 12
Or say like on the NES the actual RAM was like 128 or something like one of those things where they embrace the. Limitations that they had.
Speaker 10
The easiest waveform that will come out of this process would be a square wave, but as you change what would be called the duty cycle that is making it more like a rectangle, that's you know up more than it's down or down more than it's up. That changes the time. Or both when it's static like that, or when it's moving over time, that's when it gets very interesting.
Speaker 12
It's almost like.
Speaker 4
Do you get that one?
Speaker 10
Or when it's moving overtime, that's when it gets very interesting.
Speaker 12
It's almost Sonic.
CRAIG NORRIS
It's.
Speaker 4
It's not the yeah, this is meant to be.
Speaker 6
That.
Speaker 10
Or when it's moving overtime, that's when it gets very interesting.
Speaker 12
It's almost like a planned demolition, but there's also a bit of what we what we call party at the beginning of it, there's the.
CRAIG NORRIS
I don't know where that goes.
Speaker 11
The Game Boy had four channels of audio.
Speaker 9
It was even limited compared to the bigger consoles.
Speaker 11
Three of them were just. They're called PSG. Sounds like a bleep or a bloop.
Speaker 9
But again, they had an oscillator, maybe could do FM, they could do a little bit of modulation.
Speaker 11
The 4th channel was what's called white noise, so that was just like a if you made it really low, sounded like an explosion.
Speaker 9
Using module.
Speaker 4
If you ever heard that.
Speaker 7
Pretty.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
No.
CRAIG NORRIS
Duck hunt.
Speaker 9
Leading synthesiser. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. It almost has a laughing quality.
Speaker 11
Putting a little pitch shift in there to kind of replicate.
Speaker 9
It's kind of fun when when you know, games tease you, is that the best you can do, you know?
Speaker 12
It was something that was crafted with the express intention to make you want to shoot that dog, unfortunately.
CRAIG NORRIS
And you interesting that kind of. They're saying evokes laughter that. Kind of.
Speaker 11
We're unloading as much as you could.
Speaker 12
Mario.
Speaker 10
Yes, Super Mario's sound can often be just the perfect tool to reassure you that you've accomplished something.
Speaker 12
The sound of progress.
Speaker 4
And then.
Speaker 9
If we feel like you failed, we use dissonance. So when you do certain consonant.
CRAIG NORRIS
Consonants. Right? So. Umm. Simultaneous and successive sounds associated with sweetness, pleasantness, and acceptability, the opposite of dissonance. Consonance, consonance.
Speaker 9
Actually has sympathetic vibrations.
Speaker 11
You kind of start low and go high.
Speaker 9
It's the psychology of giving you that, but. This is a.
CRAIG NORRIS
Also, Mariah also Mario. Yeah, bit of a trick question. You should do hard quiz or something. Video games.
Speaker 9
Transition sound. It's not as much iconic, but it serves the purpose from transitioning going down the pipes.
Speaker 12
Covers up the fact that hey, they're loading out a bunch of stuff in the back and then they're loading in a bunch of.
CRAIG NORRIS
Stuff in front of you or underneath you cause that's a transition sound, right? And as he's saying. At one level, it's simply distracting you from the fact that the software hardware has to do a little bit of thinking to get the next level loaded. Yeah, so the sound nicely covers that.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Hmm.
Speaker 10
Your first and possibly most.
CRAIG NORRIS
When is that action performing? What is that saying? That is the junk I was going to say? Yeah, the jump action.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Jumping.
Speaker 10
Important ability.
Speaker 12
It tracks the motion of it so well.
Speaker 9
It has the feeling of elasticity.
Speaker 10
The very definition of interaction being signalled by sound.
Speaker 9
And like so many things in music and design, it's just the feels like. Yeah, I think that works.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Still.
CRAIG NORRIS
Quick, really quick. It's really quick. It's castlevania.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
OK. Would that be like a sword slash then?
CRAIG NORRIS
They refer to it as the sound of something going by you. OK, so.
Speaker 11
If I go like. This. The attack is that that first cracking here and what they're doing, they're using a long attack on that white noise to almost, you know, to replicate something passing through the air. Genius.
Speaker 12
It felt really satisfying because everything else was so tonal around it, and this was more broadband.
CRAIG NORRIS
So it could be an error. Contra. Side scroller John.
Speaker 11
So there once again using that long lead in for the attack. This isn't one bullet coming from 1 opening. This is something that's spreading.
Speaker 12
I think what they did was they had a lot of room to be able to have their sounds kind of take up a different portion of the frequency spectrum. The music kind of sat in one area, the sounds for impacts and whatnot, sat in another, and the sounds for your player's gun sat in yet another. And I think that that was like, kind of the birth place. Of us starting to get it.
Speaker 4
This.
CRAIG NORRIS
Mega Man. Well, look, we.
Speaker 7
Yeah.
CRAIG NORRIS
I think we might incorporate some of these sound effects in in future episodes. Maybe I'll use them as little stingers, so thank you for listening.
Speaker 8
Cool. Hmm.
CRAIG NORRIS
You're welcome. Yes. And for that, that audio quiz. I'll put up links to that YouTube is well worth watching the entirety of it. We're only halfway through where they discuss films for sorry, video games from 1972 to 1998, part one. They then do modern video game sounds. Yeah. So yes, I'll put links to that in the show notes which are going to be available on the absolute description on YouTube or via your podcast provider of Choice next week, Marcus will be joining us to deep dive into the I think we need the end of the list of. WrestleMania top ten wrestlemanias. So I think we're in the the top four at the moment.
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Ah, yes, yes.
CRAIG NORRIS
So you can see those previous episodes if you want to do your homework, you can listen to those previous WrestleMania episodes on on YouTube or via edgeradio.org dot AU or your podcast provider of choice. You can find out more about media mothership on Facebook and Instagram. Keep listening of course to Edge Radio coming up next, we've got Kpop Unlimited with the. TJ and DJ CJ. Anything going on in Cpop unlimited?
TAYLOR LIDSTONE
Uhm.
CRAIG NORRIS
Burning fire. OK. You asking me? Yeah. Thoughtful words. Burning fire because it is cold, so wonderful to have that burning fire vibe. On the airwaves from. 5:00 thanks again for listening. This is the media mothership.
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